Dan Ray is a link builder extraordinaire with an impeccable track record. No longer taking clients consistently, he runs a very successful business teaching his unique approach to link building. His systems and processes are all about eliminating what’s not needed and just focusing on things that deliver results with minimum effort.
In this episode, Dan shares some of the secrets of his unique and highly effective link building system. He also walks us through the core concepts of the way he runs his business and gives us the 80/20 on the most effective strategies in SEO today.
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Joe Troyer 0:58
Hi everybody, it's Joe Troyer here from show me the nuggets. And I have a very fascinating entrepreneur with us today. His name is Dan Ray. And we'll be bringing on Dan in just a few minutes. So Dan runs a Ray Digital Marketing, a white hat link building company that typically works with a handful of clients at a time. And he also runs a blog, Dan Ray.me, where he writes about marketing campaigns and his success and wins and failures as well. And super excited to bring on Dan as he's a fellow SEO, and entrepreneur, but I love his approach to how he's productized his business as well. So I'm super excited to to pick his brain today. So Dan, man, without further ado, welcome to the show.
Dan Ray 1:03
What's up? Good to be here.
Joe Troyer 1:30
Awesome, brother. So you're in the UK, right?
Dan Ray 1:50
I am indeed, the place called Leeds Northern England.
Joe Troyer 1:52
Okay, good stuff, man. So I'm really curious before we get into the weeds of SEO, how'd you get started in your In your digital marketing journey,
Dan Ray 2:01
so I mean, so when when you ask people this is mostly an accident, right? And mine's no different. So I was a student and Oh yeah, I was a student I wanted to write articles and I write an article somebody's gonna give me 30 pounds for it. And at the time that's really good money because you're a student, right? So I'm writing a couple of articles a week and somebody says to me once, can you SEO optimize your article? I'm like, no idea what this is, so I'm like, What the fuck is SEO? absolutely no idea. So yeah, I'll do it anyway. Because the price is double, so I'm like. Yeah, i'll do it and then I googled it and tried to figure out what to do. And the whole reason I'm here is Pat Flynn. Pat Flynn used to have an article called backlinks, the backlink strategy that worked. That was from an old warrior forum thread, and here we are.
Joe Troyer 2:52
That's awesome. Tell us a little bit more about that. How did you stumble across the thread? What did that mean? unpack that a little bit more, if you will.
Dan Ray 2:58
Well, I I just googled how to SEO like most people probably do, right? saw Pat Flynn there, that he was because at the time, he was doing a live thing where he was trying to grow a, he was an affiliate site in architecture or something. So I was just following that live doing it. And I said oh, this is actually really fucking easy, like, so then there's another guy who's like, quite well known. And we sort of we met each other on a forum like a, like a bodybuilding forum type thing. And, yeah, you know, it's a forum talking about there is. So we started a couple of sites together, and then we eventually sold that and we're like, why don't we just do this for other people, because we're making decent money at this point in selling like info products and all that. So we went, well, why don't we just do this for other people. I walked around my local town with a digital camera. This is when it wasn't on your phone, right? So I had an actual digital camera just took pictures of every single business that had like a phone number and a web address. And just like I went home, called them all made about 35 Close to 5000 pounds on the first day. And then I was like, you know you've arrived like, you never have to worry about money again, because it's this easy to get it.
Joe Troyer 4:09
That's awesome, man. So funny how we all end up in pure accident in this space, that the tails are pretty hilarious. I think I should take all the clips of all the crazy tales and put them into a story like a timeline video of just everybody's crazy stories and then figure out how they mesh and interact, right?
Dan Ray 4:27
Yeah, and like make a web of like, Who did it? Who did what methods and stuff like that? I've never ever ever cold called called since I did it one day.
Joe Troyer 4:38
That's awesome. So tell us now, tell us a little bit about your backstory. Dan. What are you up to these days? What are your focuses? What do you do?
Dan Ray 4:45
So it's hard to say at the moment I'm I got to a stage where it was like I'd made enough money because I was I was doing I was doing you know white hat outreach. By white hat all I mean by that is you Manual prospecting and then sending an email to somebody, not none of its white hat. But that's what people refer to as white hat in my book, and there weren't many people doing it back in the day. So I could charge an absolute fortune for it. Now, just every month, it just like popped up, and the money was just going up. So it got to a certain level where I was just like, right, I don't want to talk to people anymore. So like, fuck it, oh, then Corona happened. So I'm sat there thinking, I've got, you know, retirement money. And then Corona happens. It's like, suddenly, like, the house I was living in was quite small and dark, and it was not great. So when Corona happened, then we couldn't go out anymore. I was like, because I'm really high risk as well have some disabilities. We moved into this like gorgeous house, and it's massive, but I'm like, well, do I want to live in a rented house so you should be able to buy my house, right? I didn't have enough money. So I'm trying to get the money now to buy it. But you know that money doesn't grow on trees. So now I've started doing clients. Again, well, I haven't been for a long time.
Joe Troyer 6:02
So COVID drastically changed your life like it's changed so many people's. So you're up, you're prospecting again, you're getting clients again, you've turned back on your agency so to speak. That seems like a big focus. Let's go there for a second man. Let's talk about, you know, what are you doing for link building these days? what's what's working? Maybe give us a little, little hint on maybe what everybody's talking about these days, they think is working, just flat out is import or something interesting. Give us sexy in
Dan Ray 6:32
there. The so do you know who areacode is? Right? Eric Ward pretty much either invented link building was one of the very first to do it publicly. Right. All I do now is exactly what he said to do. And we're talking 10 years ago, but I have a systemized way of doing it. So I use Google Sheets to make make sure that clients can see the work being done live so I don't have to send reports. My staff can go in one prospector can add the prospects One guy can go take the prospects and then email them. And then if we get a guest post or whatever, they assign that to a writer, they're all in a team together in slack. And I honestly believe when people come to me and say, I can't get links, I don't understand what they mean. Because it's, it's really easy, but just really repetitive. On the easiest thing in the world, you put something cool in front of people who might be interested in it. So I mean, the thing that we do that probably sets us apart from most people our emails that we send are completely unique. So we send much less we're sending about 30 emails a day. We research the person we do a lot a lot in terms of the prospecting. So our prospectors are probably more important than our outreach people. But we're making sure we know about the person we can make an individual connection with them, because so many people are doing our outreach now, right, but they're sending 10,000 emails a day. And while it might work in terms of numbers, I'd rather send 10,000 over 10 years and get way more Links, we tend to get thirty three emails sent, we get one link. And that's really just through purely unique outreach. And I've never, I've never seen another person that wasn't trained by us who can do those numbers.
Joe Troyer 8:13
That's awesome. Are you? Are you doing sponsored links are you paying for it isn't just reliant on your content, we what's your point of view and how you handle you know, outreach and white hat link building. There's all kinds of versions of that so to speak, and definitions to people. I'm curious, you know what, what you think there
Dan Ray 8:34
so we will pay for links if the client specifically asks us to, and they do sometimes they're just like get us, you know, 25 links as quickly as possible here is the budget but the way we prefer to the way where I think we stand out because they can go get that somewhere else for cheaper, because that's really easy link building right you send 1000 emails and then you say, and you get so many back ups, let's say the price is $25 $50, whatever and you just pick the best 10 and then youget 10 links with a month that you can do in a couple of days, I think there's a real like, really something to be said you can be proud of each link you get, like, if you've if you come up with an idea and you've gone from right from the beginning of these are the ideas that are going to attract people to our content. People really like this and, and then you got to show it to people manually. And they say yeah, that's really fucking cool. We'll link to it. To me that's, that's what sets our service apart. And that's why we can charge when other people.
Joe Troyer 9:27
Gotcha. Yeah. So you're really coming up with linkable assets or some type of strategy to get the links inbound versus kind of the running your mail contact, churn and burn. Kind of pay for the like, type of strategy.
Dan Ray 9:40
Yeah, exactly. We're looking for like, we want to show people the best version of that thing that exists. If a better version exists, why the fuck are we showing it to people? So we need to be the absolute best in that and it can cost a lot of money and that's why like a lot of them. I think a lot of link builders make their money by selling to other SEOs, people doing affiliate sites and selling you know, 10 guest posts whatever most of our money comes from actual businesses who they really want to, like, I guess a lot of people call it content marketing, but it's just fucking link building, but to something that you make. So the ideation process and the prospecting process are the most important parts for us, that we just, you know, something that needs to be done to get in front of the right people.
Joe Troyer 10:22
Yeah, that makes perfect sense. Obviously. I mean, there really is no big difference between content creation and link building besides just where you focus your time and efforts. Somebody had to do content marketing, but then they never actually market the content, right, the number of outreach to get links to it so that it doesn't really matter.
Dan Ray 10:41
Yeah. So like a really cool way to, you know, find clients. Go and find people who, you know, people have done the skyscraper technique, because they've seen it, like, I'm Brian Dean's blog or whatever. So many people have tried it, and then not build links to it because the skyscraper method doesn't work that well because it includes the outreach part. But if you go to people who haven't linked to the competitive competing article ever, like, you've got a really good piece of content that's right for links that you can go and get fresh prospects to. And that's like, if you can, if you can do that for three or four months, that's like 20 grand, and people just don't think you can find. You gotta find abandoned skyscrapers. There are limits to them.
Joe Troyer 10:41
Yeah, go find people that have already done 90% of the heavy lifting that help them get to the finish line, basically. Yeah, love it. Easy peasy stuff. So when my team was researching you, Dan before the interview, they they found some interesting things. Not really. They found that minimalism, they found that they were really big on minimalism, right and kind of is a big core concept for you. It seems like for your business, for your personal life your training, your teaching kind of everything. From start to finish, can you give us a glimpse of how that looks in practice for you? What is minimalism mean to you?
Dan Ray 12:06
I mean, for the whole of lockdown we're talking on we've been six months now. five months, six months. I've not left the house since February. Basically, I have one rucksack of clothes. We're not talking too big looks like we're talking can fit on a plane in hand luggage. That's all I've had for the whole lockdown. But, so that's some would say like, I do want more things than that. But that's how I've been able to survive. And to me, that's minimalism to an extreme degree, because you should have shit that you like, right? If you if you really like it, I don't care. I've been having loads of stuff if you really like that stuff. But in terms of a business perspective, it just, it's essentially cutting the fat right? If you have stuff that you don't need in your processes, just cut it the fuck out. Like you We have all these people, one of the hardest parts of link building is metrics, meeting the metrics of what your clients want. So I say to my clients, we don't do metrics. Because it removes the part we have to go and find metrics. But it's also like a core philosophy thing in terms of like, I don't believe in metrics that much, because I would rather I'd rather go and get a le link was perfectly relevant, the one that had better metrics, and if it has shit metrics, who's to say that in a couple of years, your link doesn't grow with that site? Like if they're not gonna come in blog? They might be might be a great link in a couple years. Yeah. So essentially, what I'm saying is I cut the shit shout, I do if he's not absolutely essential, close it out.
Joe Troyer 13:41
And and what's the core concept behind that? Like, why do you feel that way? Is it because you feel like life's just easier that way that there's less decisions to make you think, like, what if, if you had to sum it up like why do you think you have such a focus on minimalism
Dan Ray 13:57
there's a there's a video if you go to my blog on the homepage, I don't really update my blog. So don't expect to find anything great on all my content is in my Facebook groups. You, you'll find a video called my core story, right? And this is like a part of the, the whole methodology of how to get over your, your own ego. Right. And I wouldn't go through briefly but there's there's a long version is a YouTube video on my on my blog homepage, I have chronic kidney disease and also what's called brittle diabetes. The issue you have with these two things is when you treat one, it fucks the other one, so I have to choose how I'm saying right? And every couple of years, maybe every two years, almost on the button. I'm a bit over that now. So I'm probably do one. my kidneys just fail overnight. They just stopped working. Right and I spent 30 days in hospital ish, maybe more or maybe a bit less, essentially for a couple of months. I don't feel like working I can't do anything. So what my goal was I that day when I told you Make five grand on the first day, right? A couple of months later, I get needs hospital I mean for five weeks, guess what happens to those clients? So I'm just like, right, come back out find anything again, build up a new state of the clients, then happened again. So what the fuck do I do like I need I need a proper solution for this shit. So that's that's how things were born. I was like I need to, I need a business where I can disappear for a long period of time and the clients don't just leave. So that's how we ended up here really like systemized Yeah, to systemize the processes. It requires a minimalist mindset, because I want people who've never done SEO before to be able to build links to my standard by following my set of instructions. So you have to cut out all the fat just so they can understand it.
Joe Troyer 15:50
That makes perfect sense. Is that why you started transitioning them into a more of a info marketer kind of business model as well because of your health issues and I mean it would seem Like that would make sense, right? Like, look, I mean, focus on what's working bad clients, you know, whatever.
Dan Ray 16:07
Well, that's, I mean, that's somewhat, essentially what I thought was, if I sell something that's a couple hundred pounds, I don't give a fuck if I had to refund it, but if, if a client needs me, I'm a little bit good. And then I was like this is gonna sound so fucking arrogant. I could, I was in all the Facebook groups, and I thought it was shit. I was like, What because my philosophy with Facebook group was, say something, then do a live video of me doing that thing. So everything that you ever hear me say, you can watch me doing it live, because the videos are all there. So nobody can ever say that shit or that doesn't work because I did it in front of you. Like I don't mind failing in front of you because I learned that it doesn't work as well. So the idea was I thought I could do it better than other people. That's why so and it and then it's just a little bit of greed like you know, I can make a lot of money doing it.
Joe Troyer 17:00
That's interesting man. Dan tell us why did you decide to focus fully on link building? Right? You could have focused on on page, you could have focused on other parts of SEO or other parts of marketing. You could have kept writing content, right? I'm curious, why did you stick
Dan Ray 17:19
in that one way. And it's the easiest to systemize. It's the part that I was always the best at. And it was the easiest part systemize if you if you have to tell somebody in a set of instructions, say, say for example, I hire a new Filipino person who is really willing to work, they're hungry, and they're cheap. And I tell them make an assessment on something. They can't really do that. So you have to have a clear set of things a clear set of criteria that they can follow. Does it have this Yes or no? Does it have this yes or no. And it's much harder to do that with things like on page is easier now we'd like with tools like horn surfer, and park and things like that. But back in the day, you couldn't do that. So yeah. That was a simple choice. I could do the best I could teach it the best.
Joe Troyer 18:03
That's awesome. Yeah, that makes perfect sense. So right now, it's all about content, good content or linkable assets, as people say. So when a client hires you, is that kind of a prerequisite that they have to have good content, or you create that for them? Or now we can also understand where's the start where's the finish?
Dan Ray 18:22
Yeah, I mean, a lot of a lot of clients who come to us they'll already because because of the way that I sell, it's really, really, really soft. I'm really bad at sales. So I figured the best way to do that would be to like, here's exactly what I do to the level where you can do it yourself. And if you don't want to do it, here's my price. That's, that's, that's the only way I sell. So people send traffic to that page. And they either like probably read or they don't. So clients generally they already know what they're going to get when they hire us. But there are cases where people will be like, oh, like we're really interested in your process. We haven't got content, and obviously I'll help them.
Joe Troyer 19:03
Gotcha, How? How do you make really good, attractive, appealing content? For unattractive? unappealing verticals or niches ? Can you maybe give us some outside the box examples? Because I know that there's, there's a person on the other end of this going, Yeah, but I have a client that like they do underwater basket weaving or I have a client and there a divorce lawyer like gonna link to that or I have a client that like literally sucks the shit out of porta potties. Like how do I write like... I try to think of something crazy. That's all that I could come up with. But can you give us some maybe some outside the box examples or ways that you can create linkable assets when maybe the topic just isn't that great?
Dan Ray 19:53
It will sometimes it's not about your asset. Your asset can be money, your asset can be you Know your own personality. Like, if someone, to be honest sucking shit out of porta potties would be really easy link building, how many people would want to interview that person? Right? it's really easy to do. And so, I give you an example. That's probably the hardest one I ever done because it's just really fucking boring. Right? There's, there's a part of the arm of every sofa, and there's a company in England, that makes that part. How the fuck do you get links to that? Right? So what we did we called every single elderly care home, and we said, Have you got any broken sofas? We'll fix them for you. So we use their knowledge and expertise to fix the sofa that cost them barely anything. And then obviously the nursing homes are willing to link to that newspapers are willing to link to that or every single mommy or daddy blog in the world is willing to link to that, cause it's a feel good story is wholesome they don't know it's like some sneaky fucking marketer behind the idea. but what they see is the good that's been done?
Joe Troyer 21:02
No man, I love it. So yeah, you've got a broken sofa. This is what we do. We're here to help. This is our mission. This is our values. This is why we're doing it, that's an amazing story
Dan Ray 21:11
on broken sofas, Let us fix it for free. And that's a newsworthy story. So a lot, a lot of what I tell people is you can find, find where the audience are, who is interested in what you have, who can you help. I often talk about like the big four, right? If you can, if you can make whatever you're doing, help people who are elderly, children, physically disabled, or mentally disabled. You can, if you can appeal to those people and actually help those people or the people who care about those people. It's such a passionate set of people that if you can get anything in front of them, they're happy to share it. And that and that's and that goes for anything you should take that message right. If people are passionate about something and you can help that type of people, they'll link to you all day long.
Joe Troyer 22:05
that's that's really good shit right there man was the Golden Nugget, the one gold nugget that any link builder to get out today man that was that was really good. I'm curious I had to take it full circle. Let's use that example how do you not outreach to let's say a mommy blog which you said and get them involved in the story to get a like how would you pitch that what would your pitch look like?
Dan Ray 22:28
So the thing that we do and this is this is going to be far too much for the people cause it's very time consuming, but I'll tell you our process now tell you maybe maybe a shorter one that might work. We're going to find out when you say you're pitching a mommy blog, right? We're going to find out who that mommy is. What what issues do her kids have? What does she need help with? Like have they recently bought a puppy? Is it shitting on the carpet? We'll find out all these like little tidbits, you know the type of conversation you have with mate what have you been up to this week? Joe? Oh my dog shit on the floor and then nmma came over and sucked it up a porta potty. We want to find out that stuff about you which is generally on social media because if funny shit happens they put it on social media especially if you're a blogger. Yep. So we're gonna find out all that stuff. And then we talked about that with them. Oh I know, I remember when I had a puppy like she shit everywhere that kind of thing as you chew through walls and fucking killed our snake. You if you appeal with them, appeal to them on that sort of level like as a as a mate. First off, it drops the barriers because now people get so many guest posts pitches, they're just like, yeah, it's 200 pounds. Or just know. If you talk to them as a person, then you're like, oh, by the way. The reason I actually contact you was you want a guest post? Yeah, sure. Because we're friends now. And every time you have an every time you have something that might be attracted to that person's blog Will you want, you want to be on that blog again? Guess what I've been given the link to it.
Joe Troyer 24:00
For sure, I love that. It's, uh,yeah, nobody's doing it. Everybody's playing the volume game. And there's nothing wrong with that. It's just a different game.
Dan Ray 24:11
volume absolutely works.
Joe Troyer 24:13
Yeah, that's really interesting.I love I love the core four, too, and thinking through that, I mean, and why. It's a way to create a linkable asset that isn't really a linkable asset, right? Like that's, it's just such a goodwill campaign, who wouldn't want to support that and that's going to help that business way more than just link building to I mean, think about the news and the PR and the stories and their customers hearing it like that's way more than just a, an SEO is linkable asset to.
Dan Ray 24:44
Yeah, and I'll give you another example of a very extreme like, different niche that might work. We, I don't usually talk politics right and it's and this might be right. Don't shoot me, for this. We're going to talk about guns for a second and guns and ammo. For a second, if there's an election coming up, you might notice there is one. Right? Generally, whichever side you're on pro con, or anti gun, pro abortion, anti abortion, right. So if you have anything along those lines, if you're I would assume that Trump is pro gun. All right?
Joe Troyer 25:21
I don't know. I would assume, as well.
Dan Ray 25:24
So so one of the sides will be pro gun one will be anti gun, right? Yep. So if you you can get on any Trump blog, just by producing Trump content, because people are hungry around election time for Trump content. And if your clients pro gun, you can squeeze that into a Trump article, if that's part of his policy. And guess who wants to link to that every gun site in the world? Is this is something else that you people should always keep an eye on the shit that's happening, right. I did it for a long time where every Marvel movie that came out or every Star Wars movie that came out? I'd be like, Can I relate this to my client? Because people are hungry for that content? If you're you, so we got we got links to a car loan. Right one of the one of the shittiest industries in the world to get links to car loan company, right? How much does the Millennium Falcon cost and stuff and run? Because Star Wars is coming out in 25 links in an industry that cost thousands for links. Really easy.
Joe Troyer 26:27
You literally wrote that content.
Dan Ray 26:30
We made an infographic on it. How much were Chewbacca cost? to staff for you, right.
Joe Troyer 26:37
Oh, oh, that's awesome. I love it. What would you say to somebody that like argued like, but that's not relative. That's not you know, that's not contextual. Like those, you know, auto loan and, you know, Star Wars. What, what would you say?
Dan Ray 26:53
I'd say it's an article about cars. We're mentioning car parts. It's a link industry where you can't get free links. If somebody wants free links in that industry, they have to make some relevance changes, because you got what you knew how many how many websites talk about car loans, that aren't car loan companies. Yeah, if they want free links, they can go buy links all day long. If they want free links, you have to make these little sacrifices.
Joe Troyer 27:22
Gotcha. That makes sense. Awesome, man. So talking about your minimalist approach to link building your team, your management. I'm curious, what do you think's the 80/20 in terms of the core systems processes that an SEO needs to build if they wanted to follow in your direction or any marketer, right if they wanted to follow in your direction, whatever. Yeah, don't worry about these things. Just worry about this and you're set. here's here's the, here's a few things versus I know, though to do, everybody overcomplicate the shit out of it, in my opinion, right and it's always like this little thing. changed, and it's changing the world. And then, you know, the next week, it's a different thing. And at the end of the day, neither of that really mattered. And so I love your approach. It's super refreshing. I'm curious what you think is kind of the 80/20 of what you do, or how somebody could follow in their footsteps.
The way I see it, you need four systems in your company, right? If you want to do exactly what I do today, you need four things. You need a way to get clients, a way to build links, a way to hire staff and a way to train staff. If you can do those four things, you can do exactly what I do tomorrow, right? Luckily, there are people who sell these things. I don't know where you could get them. But the intent of the 8020 to be a bit more serious. prospecting people do not spend enough time prospecting. The reason that your link rate is probably one in 1000 is because your prospects are shit. Sometimes you can, you can send the exact same guest post template to the right prospects. And you'll get way, way, way, way smaller numbers. So I think if people spend 80% of their time prospecting and 20% on outreach, they do way they're really like, this is what I do not understand, right? So many people, I've sold like 2000 copies of my link building system. And yet nobody's building links. So it's like, you're just not following it. Like, the biggest issue I think is people don't do the absolute basics. And do the basics well and consistently, and you're way better than most of the people.
Joe Troyer 29:36
Yeah, it's the fundamentals. It always comes back to the fundamentals. So many people skip the fundamentals. And they just keep grabbing the newest, latest, greatest whatever whiz bang, then then they look up 12 months, 18 months, 24 months later and go Holy shit, like, I've changed my SOPs or lack thereof every month because I've been focused on kind of what's hot, what's sexy, instead of what matters. Yeah,
Dan Ray 30:01
I give out a free like, isn't my link building systems like 25 types of links or something like that? I give a free one that's guest posts and resource page links, because they're, they're low value links, really. But people want them a lot. So essentially, you can go and do exactly what I do for free, just by looking at a page on my site, right? And the amount of people who they view it and then show me what they're doing and why it isn't working. And all I do is I look at them straight away and say, why did you miss that step? or Why did you change that? Oh, I thought it'd be better don't fucking think I'm giving you the system.
Joe Troyer 30:39
I love that. Don't fucking think. Yeah, I mean, a really really wise friend of mine has always told me always been the guy tapping me on the shoulder like that new business seven figures yet? No. Then why are you not just imitating like swipe deploy, copy like you should not be innovating at all right like until you until you get to seven figures, you should just be completely, like just just copying. You know, take what works, don't innovate, like follow, you know, pay for somebody's coaching but just do exactly what they do.
Dan Ray 31:22
I similar way to you. My strategy is Eric Ward's strategy. It's just I've systemized it. So it's not a book anymore. It's a set of spreadsheets that do the exact same thing. And someone, someone, someone can come into my paid membership today, it's 95 pounds, right? I have something in there called the quick hustle. And it's not meant to make you rich. It's not meant to give you any sort of sustainable income. Whereas if you need money tomorrow, here's how to get it. It's very, very simple strategy. It's not even mine. I took it from somewhere else. The guy called Brian Harris If you know he's cool as fuck, yeah, I took this strategy and adapted it. And it works every single time we do it every single time, but you spend about 25 emails, and you get a client, and they probably probably lower than if you're selling 5000 pound service, you might sell it for 3000 because it has to be a win win, it has to be a no brainer to do it. Right. But you have three grand that you didn't have yesterday, people. So people come in, they start doing it, don't finish it. And then they leave saying shit. It's like, you didn't do the thing that the number one thing is step one, you can't deal with the stuff. So it will not. But we have complete templates like everything. As I said earlier, everything that I say, there's an example of me doing it live in the group. If you missed it live, there's a recording where you can sit there for four hours and watch me do this stuff. The most boring, laborious shit in the world, but people pay me money, So if someone comes in, they just want to pay for that. They they can come in one day, pay me 95 pounds, rip all my shit. And then leave and make 100 grand a month.
Joe Troyer 33:12
And you're okay with that?
Dan Ray 33:14
Joe Troyer 33:19
Got to ask you the infamous question, right?So,and it's infamous because everybody thinks this way. But I'm curious to see your point of view on it. Right? I got to ask you the if you had to start all over again, right. Question, right. If you had to go back to zero, if you ended up in the hospital again, let's say but you lost your memory to if you had to start back at zero, right? Like what what would change like what would you tell your younger self?
Dan Ray 33:49
Oh, and tell me you make myself be fucking consistent, man. Like, if you if you do the same thing over and over and over again, most things work. I find somebody find somebody to model and just do it over and over and over again. The amount of times I've found something that works and stop doing it and then be like, oh, like, why do I not do that anymore? Just be consistent. Like, you'll be, you'll be alright. The money is absolutely abundant. All you have to do is find a way to go and get your hands on it. And there's plenty of people showing you how I'm sure I'm sure you're showing people how and definitely showing people how.
Joe Troyer 34:27
for sure. Absolutely. Love it, man. So true. So true. All right, dude, I really appreciate having you on this has been awesome. It's been refreshing. We'll make sure that that we link up your course and your little freebie course as well. So we'll link up Dan ray.me and also your Ray digital marketing. Um, instead of asking you to recommend three books, which I feel like every podcast does, I want to ask if there's one book that you think has made the biggest impact on the way that you do business and why? It was just like Joe, I can I can only recommend you one book
Dan Ray 35:02
okay right now guy Over Subscribed by Daniel Priestley. If you're having if you're having trouble getting clients just read that book. You'd be fine
Joe Troyer 35:15
Perfect, mate, Dude, Dan it's been frickin awesome if there's anything that I can ever do for you please don't hesitate to reach out this has been awesome I'm sure that all the podcast listeners are going to absolutely love this episode super refreshing man and I hope that you stay healthy man going through Corona, I really mean that and have an absolutely fantastic weekend to see you guys